Dr. Don Clark of Creation Moments discusses, along with Jim and David, an article from the Institute for Creation Research that examines some of the differences between young earth and old earth proponents who happen to be Christians, and pertaining to whether Adam was an historical man, when death began and whether Neandertals were fully human after all …
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This is a spiritual point, “For the wages of sin is death.” If there was death before sin, then there is no penalty for sin. Some may assume that this only applied to Adam and Eve. I believe this also applied to the animals. Both man and animals ate plants, and like today, many plants go through cycles of fruiting, seeding, and dying. So, at least those types of plants died. In the creation order, something is different between plants and animals and plants and man. Call it a soul, that part of us that gives us mobility and a personality. For these reasons, I believe animals did not die until sin entered the world. Maybe some animals had access to the Tree of Life, but not all. For example, there were beasts of the field.
From a spiritual perspective, we understand the importance of the Tree of Life in the garden, as referenced in Rev 2 and 22. Jesus is The Tree of Life, and our life flows from Him. Yes, Adam and Eve lost access to the Tree when they sinned and died. Granted, it took a while before they died, 930 years for Adam, but they still died. Had they not sinned, they would not have died.
We have no clue as to how long after they were created before they sinned. Probably not too long. Less than a year? We just do not know.
I hope this is of some help. Blessings.
Just a question for clarification regarding your response to Charles. You stated that The Tree of Life must have provided some form of sustaining life ability, which I agree with. And that the animals did not eat each other nor was there decease, which I agree with. However, if the Tre of Life was the source of eternal life, did the animals also eat of it? What kept them from aging to the point of death? I believe in Biblical Creation approximately 6,000 years ago and I do not believe in death before sin, just questioning how it applies to the Tree of Life regarding animals and I’m assuming fish/sea mammals?
Thanks Charles for you post. Yes I am saying that the animals did not die before the Fall. Man and the animals were plant eaters so of course the plants died and many plants go through annual cycles of life and death anyway. The Tree of Life in the Garden was a physical representation of the Tree of Life mentioned in Revelation 22 which is referring to Jesus Christ. He is our eternal life. There must have been some substance in the fruit of the Tree of Life that renewed the life of those who ate it, in this case Adam and Eve. Our DNA can only replicate a certain number of times thus limiting our life span. If this substance removed this limitation on DNA replication, then Man could live forever. I believe this was God’s original intent since God placed death as a condition of sin. Thus before Adam sinned there could be no death. This helps explain why death for man didn’t enter in before sin but what about the animals?
As is stated in Genesis 1:30 God gave every green plant to the animals to eat. Note that they were not eating each other. God also initially created the Earth and universe to be perfect (it was very good). There was no disease to kill the animals. Without the animals eating each other and without disease in a perfect environment the animals did not die either. So Adam’s sin brought not only death to man but also to the animals (Rom 8:22). It effected all of creation.
While this may not seem to be a significant point and one might allow death of animals before the fall, death is a major requirement for evolution. Without death evolution can not take place because there would be no trial and error. with the weaker dying off and the stronger surviving. And at what point in the evolutionary scheme of things does a pre-human undergoing cycles of death and evolving become a non-dying man describe in Genesis 1 and 2? It doesn’t make sense. So again, animals must not have died before the Fall.
I trust this is has been helpful. Dr. Don
If I understand what your are saying, “There is no death on the earth until Adam sinned?” You are saying no plant or animal died before Adam sinned? Or was it just animals that didn’t die? If that’s the case, why was it necessary for Adam and Eve to eat of the Tree of Life if they wanted continuing life? Weren’t angels posted to prevent Adam and Eve from the Tree of Life? It seems that death is built into creation or the Tree of Life wouldn’t be necessary. It seems the statement that no animals died until Adam and Eve sinned is a belief statement that has no basis. Why would that be necessary if I believe the Genesis account? Apparently I don’t understand your position. cb
This is a spiritual point, “For the wages of sin is death.” If there was death before sin, then there is no penalty for sin. Some may assume that this only applied to Adam and Eve. I believe this also applied to the animals. Both man and animals ate plants, and like today, many plants go through cycles of fruiting, seeding, and dying. So, at least those types of plants died. In the creation order, something is different between plants and animals and plants and man. Call it a soul, that part of us that gives us mobility and a personality. For these reasons, I believe animals did not die until sin entered the world. Maybe some animals had access to the Tree of Life, but not all. For example, there were beasts of the field.
From a spiritual perspective, we understand the importance of the Tree of Life in the garden, as referenced in Rev 2 and 22. Jesus is The Tree of Life, and our life flows from Him. Yes, Adam and Eve lost access to the Tree when they sinned and died. Granted, it took a while before they died, 930 years for Adam, but they still died. Had they not sinned, they would not have died.
We have no clue as to how long after they were created before they sinned. Probably not too long. Less than a year? We just do not know.
I hope this is of some help. Blessings.